"Really, I think 'Maria' was the beginning of starting to come alive again."

For VF, Oscar winner Angelina Jolie discusses her new film, its connection to 'Girl, Interrupted,' and finding herself as an artist again. https://t.co/IzK1hGeP52

— VANITY FAIR (@VanityFair) December 19, 2024

Stepping Out of the Dark and “Starting to Come Alive Again”

The Academy Award winner digs deep on her Oscar contender Maria, its connection to her breakout in Girl, Interrupted, and finding herself as an artist again: “Some therapist should study these things and tell me what they mean.”

By David Canfield

These days, Angelina Jolie is embracing uncharted territory. She’s coming off her turn as opera icon Maria Callas in Pablo Larraín’s stylish biopic, for which she spent months in intensive singing lessons. Having been running around Los Angeles of late, getting the word out for the film — she was nominated for both a Golden Globe and a Critics Choice Award last week — she’s now already at work on her next film. She logs on to Zoom from Paris while on a break from production for Stitches, an independent drama written and directed by Alice Winocour. In this one, Jolie plays an American filmmaker, which may sound like relatively familiar territory. But again, she’s been tasked to do something she’s never done before: perform a role mostly in French.

“I’m not fluent—I speak a bit, but…to mean every word and give a performance takes a different kind of understanding about what it is I’m saying, to be emotional and not think about the language,” she says. “It’s a different challenge.”

Until Maria, Jolie had not shot an independent film since well before the pandemic. So it’s a surprise to see her go right back into another auteur-driven, dramatically complex film; it’s been well over a decade since she’s worked with that intensity and rigor as an actor. Jolie recognizes this—over the past year, she’s felt different, reenergized, willing and eager to once more take on the kinds of artistic risks that first defined her rise as a performer, in movies like Gia and Girl, Interrupted.

It’s been almost exactly 25 years since the debut of that latter film, which won Jolie an Oscar and set her on the path of superstardom, something accompanied by what she calls her tendency to pull back from the industry’s—and the public’s—prying gaze. Maria follows Callas in the final, lonely days of her life, and in that melancholy frame, it gave Jolie the space to deliver a profoundly vulnerable performance. The role required her to look inward as few jobs of late have, and she’s still working her way through how the experience has impacted her—and what she wants to say about it. But she feels ready to forge ahead, and perhaps also consider why it’s taken her a few years “to come alive again.”

Angelina Jolie: I wasn’t myself for a while, so I wasn’t able to give as much to my work for a few years. To feel like I could work again and communicate and to be with nice people—so much of what I do is collaboration with other artists. When it goes well, you’re creating together. When you’re with nice people and creative people, you learn so much about yourself and about life. You’re in a safe place to play and stretch. I had that with Pablo, and I don’t think it’s an accident that I found another situation [in Stitches] that is very similar with very well-intended, thoughtful people. I was just talking to Louis Garrel, the wonderful French actor, about our scenes and our work. I talked to Alice this morning about life and women’s health, which is a bit of the film. Great art, as an audience or as a participant, can really be very healing and grow us. That’s what we’re all alive for—to discover and feel and create and connect. Without that, we’re just existing, hardly.

It’s been a big part of your life for such a long time. I would imagine it felt quite meaningful to feel that again.

It really does. Probably more than I can even express. If no one receives your piece, or if you don’t connect, then it’s like shouting in the dark. It means a lot that people have responded to Maria. I’ve always felt, ever since I was very young, that film has been a way to communicate with the world and not feel as alone.

We’re all going through this human condition and this life. So it’s very, very healing to be able to be a part of these films and to talk to you about this and to live that way. And I missed it. I realized I did really miss it. I missed being an artist.

When you say you missed it, what did that period look like, where you weren’t feeling that as much?

I went very dark for reasons I’d rather not explain, but I didn’t have a lot of light and life within me. Your light’s dim. I also just needed to be home more, so I couldn’t commit large periods of time to pieces. The choice of what to work on and when was not a creative choice, often, the last few years, but sometimes the practical choice. Really, I think Maria was the beginning of starting to come alive again. I needed a lot of kind people around me to hold my hand.

The emphasis on nice people—

I know I say it too often, but our business can be a lot of things. At the end of the day, we’re very fortunate to do what we do, and we are spending a lot of time with big, deep, emotional feelings. If you don’t do that with people who you’re safe with, it can affect you in very bad ways.

It sounds like something you’ve learned over time.

Oh, sure. We’ve all been with terrible people in our life, where it’s hard to do your work because you feel emotionally vulnerable and then you feel like it’s being used in the wrong way. With a lot of artists, we’re kind of raw. It’s why we sometimes seem a little crazy. Part of what we do is not to be settled. It’s to feel deeply and explore and go to strange places in our mind and our body. If you’re free to do that, these wonderful things can happen. And then sometimes you can be a very vulnerable person in a world that’s a bit dark—and we can break.

Maria is very vulnerable, obviously. What did that experience, on a practical level, feel like to go through on set from day to day?

It was heavy. Maria was a very full experience. I wasn’t able to leave her on set like you sometimes do. Part of that was because I was always doing training after [shooting] anyway; there was always a next aria. But it was all leading towards the death, and the death was the last thing we shot. I’m almost 50, and my mom had cancer when she was 48. You’re actually thinking about death, about things that cause you grief or that you have lost in your life.

I imagine you and maybe a lot of people you know have had moments where you feel so full of grief, but you’re alone. I’ve certainly had those moments of grief alone. To also share them now with not just the set but the world, and to meet other people and recognize that we both have that level of pain, can feel very cathartic—to express heavy things together. She was also funny, but the heavy side, she was…yeah. [Laughs] I think it made me want to try to live more fully. Anytime you do anything about death, you think often about life, naturally.

There’s a nice shape to this moment, given that it’s been 25 years since Girl, Interrupted came out, for which you won an Oscar. You played Lisa, a diagnosed sociopath in psychiatric care—another very heavy character. How do you compare where you are as an actor and an artist to back then?

I haven’t really figured out how I feel about it, but there’s something beautiful or comforting in that there’s something not dissimilar about these women and the person I was 25 years ago. Maybe I’ve come around to her in a different way. Maybe I haven’t lost her as much as I thought I did. Hopefully I’m better in ways: I’m a parent and I’m many other things.

Maybe I’m still trying to connect and maybe I’m still feeling deeply. I don’t know. I’m sure a therapist would have a field day with this one. You’re asking me, and I’m like, my God, some therapist should study these things and tell me what they mean.

Do you remember what it felt like to play Lisa at the time?

I do, which is interesting because I don’t have a lot of memory of my life. I remember that I didn’t think of her as crazy and that she was a real person. She needed to be loved, and she felt alone, and she wanted truth. I only saw it once—it’s hard for me to talk about it because I saw it once 25 years ago—but from my memory, she wanted someone to be honest with her and to connect, and somehow ended up feeling very, very alone in that way—not dissimilar to Maria. Not finding somebody who understood her enough, not finding a way forward where she was okay. Is this a theme? That I’m alone? What is this? [Laughs] There’s probably some very tragic thing that I don’t want to address right now, but—yeah.

Yeah, I understand. Looking back at coverage of the film, Lisa was often talked about as crazy and without the kind of nuance that you’re talking about now. Do you remember encountering that?

I do remember hearing people saying that. Even if they thought they were complimenting me playing Lisa, they were complimenting me playing a crazy person. That did make me sad because I didn’t think of her that way, and I didn’t like hearing I was referred to that way. But it was also a time where I was still trying to understand myself, and maybe there was something about me that I was not understanding—about what people consider crazy. I mean, that’s the honest truth. The honest truth was during that time when you’re trying to figure yourself out and you’re young and you’re a bit wild and strong and curious and emotional—and people say, “No, that’s crazy. She’s crazy. You’re crazy.” It probably just isolated me more and made me think I must be different. Maybe I’m dark, or maybe I’m off, or maybe I’m not what people want me to be either.

Has it felt different with Maria? Just anecdotally, I’ve heard people expressing a lot more affection for her.

I don’t read things, but I have talked to people after screenings who’ve been really kind. But then I’ll also hear people refer to her as a little crazy. People can still watch her and miss the fact that she was this little girl that wasn’t loved.

Which is the text of the film.

Which is so much the text of the film, right. There’s nothing she does that hurts anybody or is against anybody. Somehow she’s seen as something’s wrong with her, something about her rubs people the wrong way. But yes, I think there’s a lot of love for her, and nothing makes me happier than that. If she was a diva at all, for her, it was [because] she was very tough on herself and very tough on anything having to do with her work because she was a perfectionist. She was also somebody who felt that she was perfect or she was nothing—because that’s what her mother told her. She was definitely harder on herself than anybody else could be.

Not to get too psychological, but how do you relate to that idea of perfection at all costs?

By the way, you’d be a very good therapist.

I considered it, I’ll say that. But I am genuinely curious how you connected to that part of her.

I think that’s why it took me a few days to say yes, because I knew that I was walking into the impossible. You can’t be as good as her—certainly can never be as good as her onstage, can never sing as good as her, and can only pray to not disappoint those who love her work. I was scared. I was scared to really fail this one.

Can you take me back to the moment that you took Maria to Venice and how you were feeling that day, both before the screening and after you felt the reaction in the room?

It was a funny thing bringing her to Venice because she was in Venice—we even say it in the film; Onassis talks about seeing her in the Venice Film Festival. I was trying to figure out what to wear, and there were pictures of her in Venice wearing little fur; that’s why I wore a little fake fur. It was strange. And I sing in Italian and I’m in Italy; how’s that going to go? These are people that really know these arias, and this is an art form that is very respected and understood here. I was very excited for those reasons to bring it to Venice and very nervous. When it was received well, when you felt the room appreciated it, it was a huge relief. Then when you’re with people you love, you look around at the faces of the artists that you worked with, and it’s a beautiful moment.

As you’re feeling reenergized creatively, are there filmmakers you have your eye on whom you’d like to work with, or types of work you’d like to do going forward?

What do you think I should do?

Well, as you mentioned, you get to be selectively very funny in Maria. I would love to see you get to do more comedy.

Thank you. I just wrote to a friend of mine today, Eunice, who’s in Liverpool, and she said, “Why aren’t you doing—you should do something funny.” I wrote back and I said, “I’d like to find something funny,” but I’m not sure. I’m never sure how funny I am. I would love to do something fun and light. I think I’d have to be the straight man. I feel like that’s what I am. I get that. In Maleficent, it was like, Okay, I’ll be the straight person.

There are so many wonderful directors I’d love to have a chance to work with. I’d like to just be allowed to play in this arena. I’d love for people to reach out and be willing to invite me to play with them and create with them. So we’ll see. Yeah, comedy, maybe.

Let’s put it into the universe.

If I do it, it’s on you.



This interview has been edited and condensed for clarity.

Angelina Jolie photographed by Samir Hussein for Vanity Fair pic.twitter.com/ek3BF80pO5

— Filmfect (@Filmfect) December 19, 2024

My kids saw my pain on set, says Angelina Jolie https://t.co/vvqGKb7nlt

— BBC News (World) (@BBCWorld) December 19, 2024

"The character [Callas] has a lot of pain and they've of course seen me go through a lot of things, but they hadn't experienced me expressing a lot of the pain that usually a parent hides from a child," she said.

"So they were there to witness some of that, but then we would hug or they would bring me cups of tea."

Jolie added that it was "a new way" of finding out how to be honest with her children about her feelings, "in an even greater way".

"We started with regular singing classes and it was challenging in many ways, but when the opera classes began, what it requires with your breathwork and your body and just the force of what you push through yourself, it's just a very different physicality."

Jolie, whose previous film credits include Changeling, Maleficent, Salt, and Mr & Mrs Smith, said she hasn't sung before, and was "actually quite shy about singing".

"It was probably one of the areas in my life that I was hesitant," she said.

"One of the greatest privileges of being an actor is you often are supported by a crew to try something and explore something you've never done and this certainly was most challenging," she said.

On the set of the film, both Maddox and Pax were "very busy", director Pablo Larraín said. "They were good professionals," he added.

Jolie said that during filming, Pax recorded a lot of her singing practice "so he was with me in my early horrible days," she laughed.

"It's always good for your children to watch your mum not do something easily, but swear and fight and fail and have to try again," she said.

"So that's an important and beautiful thing."

Larraín said he hoped his film honoured Callas's desire to popularise the art form.

"If this movie bring attention to opera from one to hundred to a million, it will be a success," he said.

"I don't know if there is an art form as strong as opera," Jolie added.

"The way it connects to the soul and the body, so of course it's for everybody."

Maria will be released in cinemas in the UK on 10 January.

Angelina Jolie for Vanity Fair pic.twitter.com/25Ho403RRq

— Filmfect (@Filmfect) December 22, 2024

“We wanted to make a programme with you.”

Angelina Jolie visited @BBCNews in London to sit down with students from @ChallonerCFS to talk about what #BBCMyWorld is all about.

Watch it internationally on #BBCWorldNews on Sunday at 4.30pm GMT or on @BBCiPlayer in the UK. pic.twitter.com/njsNX5I8IP

— BBC News Press Team (@BBCNewsPR) January 24, 2020

Angelina Jolie to work with @BBCWorldService to produce #BBCMyWorld, a weekly global TV show for younger audiences, presented by @iamradzi and @NomiaIqbal >> https://t.co/jOAWlcZcdq pic.twitter.com/SPvUnSoYpg

— BBC Press Office (@bbcpress) January 24, 2020

BBC My World is a groundbreaking global show for young audiences, explaining the stories behind the news, and providing facts and information for them to make up their own minds about international issues.

Dec. 15, Sunday

Well this was a shift with a difference! Angelina Jolie and nine pupils from @ChallonerCFS joined me in Broadcasting House - filming for a new #bbc programme for teenagers - My World - launching globally in January https://t.co/duZbnLwnCi

— Reeta Chakrabarti (@reetacbbc) December 16, 2019

What an incredible Sunday afternoon! Nine lucky students were filming at Broadcasting House with Angelina Jolie and @reetacbbc for a wonderful new @bbcworldservice programme. I think it's safe to say that this is a day we'll never forget. pic.twitter.com/y1h4aACIav

— Bishop Challoner CFS (@ChallonerCFS) December 16, 2019

View this post on Instagram

Just casually hanging out with angelina jolie on a Sunday thanks @themakeupteamuk #angelinajolie #bbc #news

A post shared by Marianne Makeup (@christensenmakeup) on Dec 15, 2019 at 7:44am PST

Greek restaurant Estiatorio Milos in London on Sunday evening.  With Helic, Dalton and the big guy.

dm

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I never thought I’d be one of those people who would post a thirsty shirtless, but I’ve worked way too hard for way too long so here we are. You either die a hero, or you live long enough to see yourself become the villain. I found out a year ago I was going to be in Marvel’s Eternals and decided I wanted to transform how I looked. I would not have been able to do this if I didn’t have a full year with the best trainers and nutritionists paid for by the biggest studio in the world. I’m glad I look like this, but I also understand why I never did before. It would have been impossible without these resources and time. So big thanks to @grantrobertsfit who started working with me at the beginning of the year and made me understand true physical pain for months and months. Then, once we started shooting, a massive thanks to @davidhigginslondon and his team (@ellispartridge, @thebeardypt, @tomcheesemanfitness) for training me almost every day and making me strong, limber and injury free. I can almost touch my toes now. (And thank you for forcing me to do cheat meals David.) Matthews Street Catering for their delicious and healthy meals. And finally, the biggest thanks goes to @emilyvgordon for putting up with me complaining and talking about only working out and dieting for the last year. I promise I’ll be interesting again some day. #thirstyshirtless (Photo by @markupson.) (edit: I left off one very important person: @lancecallahan who trained me for 6 years and helped me build the foundation I could use to do this. Thank you!)

A post shared by @ kumailn on Dec 16, 2019 at 8:10am PST

Mullets, misbehaving and making it in Hollywood with Brad Pitt and @LeoDiCaprio 🥰🎬#FridayFeeling #FridayThoughts #Acting pic.twitter.com/FHahMCnYt8

— BBC Breakfast (@BBCBreakfast) August 16, 2019

Dec. 28: She gave clear, unequivocal confirmation that she and Brad and the kids are together at home.

Nov. 30: She “is very pleased to be entering the next stage and relieved with progress for the health of their family.”

September, 2017:  “None of it’s easy. It’s very, very difficult, a very painful situation, and I just want my family healthy,” she said quietly.

Hear the full 20 minute interview with Hollywood actress and UN refugee envoy Angelina Jolie. She speaks about US politics, social media, sexual violence and the global refugee crisis #r4today https://t.co/6MCttgYpdR https://t.co/TZJWPhsfMF

— BBC Radio 4 Today (@BBCr4today) December 28, 2018

AJ "When I went out and started to meet refugee families, I changed my view of so many things in the world.  I met these extraordinary survivors, people who've come through against the most impossible odds, and were protecting each other  The humanity that rises within these communities is like something you've never seen before.  You don't on a daily basis meet people who are so bare, so connected to just being able to find basic needs and survive, and how full of care and love they are.  It's really very moving.  One of the things that I would encourage people to do is to look at the movements of people as a barometer for understanding what is happening within our world.  Not the less than 1% that is trying to cross a border of a developed country.  That should not be the focus.  The focus should be what is happening to these people, why is this happening, how do we have that many people uprooted.  And what are the causes."

Justin Webb, BBC  Isn't there a risk here that in some places where there are large influxes of refugees there is an impact on communities.  Not an impact on the community that you are a part of.  Not on wealthier people.  An impact on poorer people.  And when you make the points that you make, how aware are you of that.

AJ "Very aware.  One of the things that the new compact on migration is addressing is to help find ways to support these border countries that have done so much and are continuing to carry the majority of the burden.  We have to support them or we risk them becoming unstable.  This should not be seen as a headache for people.  We need our leaders to be thinking about balancing our world.  We have to bring the numbers down.  Everybody should be wondering why we are not doing enough to stabilize countries and return people.  The absolute majority of refugees would rather be home."

BBC Let's turn to sexual violence.  That very phrase is an uncomfortable one, isn't it.

AJ "It's uncomfortable, but we're adults enough to know there is nothing sexual about this.  Just that, in itself is what PSVI wants to accomplish.   To take the stigma off the victims and help people to understand why it's being used in a very calculated fashion to destroy people and community.

BBC One of the ways to challenge it is to enable victims to be able to have the words and the place to say this happened to me.

AJ  "We want to empower victims to speak, but when these brave victims come forward, what happens in some communities is they encourage the rapist to marry the victim.  In many communities, they treat the young woman as if she's now dirty, nothing happens to the men that commit these crimes.  We live in this culture of impunity.  We do need to encourage people to speak up, but we do need to have the legal framework, and the will, and the changes necessary within these communities to back them up.

BBC Does it make you feel uncomfortable though, in some of these cases there are cultural norms that we, the West. may be coming up against and in some cases shouldn't be.

AJ  "There should never be a cultural norm that is ever accepted that abuses women -- 'that's who we are, that's what we do' -- that's not acceptable.  We're talking about basic human rights. We're not talking about our opinions of whether somebody has the right to marry a child and possibly impregnate her young and put her life in harms way against her will.  It's not something we can sit back and think of as somebody else's business.

BBC  It is something that the American troops, and Brits as well, in Afghanistan -- where there is quite widespread abuse of children by Afghan forces -- a sense among some foreign soldiers including Americans and Brits, that it's a local thing and they shouldn't be involved in efforts to stamp it out.

AJ  "I love Afghanistan.  I love Afghan people.  I have a school there and have many friends.  I do not want them to become like us.  It's not about being anything like us.  It's about helping those there who are feeling oppressed and harmed to know their rights, and helping to educate those who are abusing those rights.  Do the people that are abusing, do they think because there is no accountability that there is nothing wrong with what they're doing?  Maybe the fellow officers can be very clear.  That's why NATO taking such a strong stand on these issues is important."

BBC This initiative, the British Foreign Office have reduced the team that was involved -- lawyers and psychologists and people -- there are fewer of them now.

AJ "We've gone through different Foreign Secretaries, now there is another one.  Let me say to the British people and the British government: I am so grateful as an American that the British government has taken such a strong stand and I think the British people should be so proud because it is something that is a worthwhile cause.  It has made a difference in the field.  I have met victims who finally got reparations when they didn't have them before.  It is growing and growing -- the reason why NATO is getting involved in a stronger way, but with the leadership of the British government.  If anything, the question shouldn't be what the British government is doing.  It should be more what America isn't doing on this issue when an American is the co-founder."

BBC  So you are saying the Brits have stepped up to the plate but other nations haven't.

"Not in the way the British have.  But many are.  There are people -- Canada -- many, many countries, over 150 countries have signed on to do this.  Let me be clear about something.  Here's one specific example of something that's been changed.  In the past when countries would sit together and decide their peace agreements -- 'the war's over, we're going to have a peace agreement' -- they were able to take sexual violence against women off the table.  They were allowed to just remove it and not have to talk about it as part of their peace agreement.  Now, with PSVI, if you are a signatory, you are not allowed to do that, you must keep it on the table."

BBC And that means the possibility of prosecutions will still be there.

AJ "Absolutely.  When there are prosecutions and when there is more accountability we will see more real change.  This is going to take evidence collecting and this is why we have to deploy people to learn how to collect evidence properly and work with institutions collecting evidence.

BBC Is it legitimate to say to the MeToo movement: Look, this is something you might turn to next.

AJ "I think it says a lot that it is a Conservative male that helped to lead the charge to get this done, and Gen. Scaparotti and the other men and women at NATO.  But I think none of these issues regarding women's health, women's rights should be women's issues.  I think we need men to also take a stand against those who are perpetrators and to defend and protect and partner with us to protect half of the population on the planet." 

BBC Can we turn to nationalism, it's very much in the background of international politics at the moment.  Where do you see nationalism at the moment in the world?

AJ "I asked colleagues to explain to me the difference between nationalism and patriotism.  They explained to me that to be a patriot is to be very proud of your country, even your country first, in your heart.  But you do not think that your country is better than or has more value than other people."

"A narrow nationalism, which is the only thing we're really worried about, is when people are encouraged to believe that their problems are the only ones they should be worried about and that other people's rights are not their concern in the same way."

"That's how I interpret it and I could be completely wrong and I'm not one to say what the definition is.  But I think that's the concern. 

"I'm a patriot, I'm an American, and I'm proud to be an American, but I'm an internationalist and I love and value equally other countries and other peoples."

BBC On that internationalist theme, your own children are an international group.  Given us an insight into the conversations you have about the way the world is.

AJ "My children have learned the most about these issues simply from each other, from experiencing each other.  They are from different backgrounds.  They don't deny the difference, they celebrate the difference."

BBC What have you learned from them?

AJ "Everything.  Every parent says that, but we really do.  They're all so much smarter than us."

BBC But you've got that added thing that they are coming from backgrounds, of which they haven't read in a book.

AJ "I've had to learn from them and we go to their countries, spend time in their countries.  But also they're American, American-Ethiopian, American-Cambodian.  So they have their countries and that's a piece of who they are.  I also find it interesting Shiloh for example, is the one who's learning Madd's country's language.  And Vivienne wants to live in Zahara's country.  So just because they're from a place doesn't mean that that's everything that defines them.

"When my daughters were little, Zee and Shi, we got them each a baby doll.  I got ZZ a little black doll and I got Shi a little white doll.  And they switched dolls.  And I had that immediate reaction of one of them not liking the way they are, wanting the other color.   And then I realized that's just who they see every day.  They see the other.  So to them family wasn't the one that looked like them, it was the other.

"I know it sounds like I have this...I don't see it as this softness of just equality and balance.  I find strength in diversity."

BBC How do they learn about the outside world?  And I ask that in the context of how we are all understanding the outside world.  And about social media and tech companies, and about what we can trust, etc.  What do you do at home?

AJ "I think like most parents, we try our best to insert good stuff.  We can't control everything they're exposed to." (via People: "So we try to ask that they will talk to us about anything they saw that bothers them or that they’re concerned about.”)

BBC You don't limit access, you just say go where you will...

AJ "I try, you try.  There are certain realities to teenagers.  And also our generation doesn't understand half of what they're doing with their tech, so they can get around us pretty easy."

BBC Everyone will understand that.

AJ "So I try, but this is a concern of mine.  This is why I am very happy to be working with the BBC on a children's news program.  As a mother, I just am so happy I have something I can sit with my children and watch and know that they are getting a real international sense of the world as well."

BBC Are you one of those around the world who is concerned about Facebook in particular, because there's a growing movement around the world that it is a wonderful tool but it is also eating away into something important.  Is that where you are?

AJ "I am probably not the best to discuss this.  I am not on Facebook and none of my children are on Facebook."

BBC Deliberately?

AJ "Nobody's even asked to be.  We're the last family that hasn't gone on Facebook."

BBC If they did ask though, you'd warn them about it.

AJ "Yes, we talk about social media.  The truth is that my children have seen things about themselves even from what's considered serious news people that are inaccurate.  So my children have a very odd sense of who's telling the truth and what the truth really is and what they actually believe or trust."

BBC What drives you?   You were pretty wild when you were young.  You've become serious.  What formed that transition in you.

AJ "What's funny, I don't see it.  I was a bit of a young punk.  And I loved the idea of fighting for something you believe in, however hard.  Being brave in your life, in your choices, and doing something your own way.  I don't feel I've changed much at all, in fact.

"My children have certainly...Children can do two things: they can make you grow up, and you do, and they also add a sense of wild themselves.  They are, all have a good rebellious streak that is wonderful and curious.  I don't want them to be perfectly behaved little people that just say what is absolutely appropriate because I say so, or because they think that it's...they have to find themselves.

"Maybe today, there's a lot of focus on people focusing on their selves, their needs, their opinions, their sculpted news.  Maybe the new rebellion is to hold to your values and to understand policies and politics and fight for your fellow man.  Maybe that actually is the rebellion."

BBC I talked years ago on the program to Donal Trump, when he was a businessman, and I asked if he was going to stand for president, and he said, "Yes, I am."  Nobody took it very seriously.  I am not necessarily getting you to run for president on the program.  Are you moving in the direction of politics?  Is that where you naturally go?

AJ "That would be, I don't...honestly if you asked me 20 years ago I would have laughed.  I really don't know.  I always say I'll go where I'm needed.  I don't know if I'm fit for politics, but then I've also joked that I don't know if I have a skeleton left in my closet, so I'm pretty open and out there.  I can take a lot on the chin, so that's good.  I honestly will do whatever I think can really make change, and right now I am able to work with a UN agency that is the most in the field of all the UN agencies, to do a lot of work directly with the people in need.  I'm also able to work with governments.  And I'm also able to work with militaries.  So I sit in a very interesting place of being able to get a lot done, without a title and without it being about myself or my policies.  So for now, I'll stay quiet. "

BBC For now?  That's fascinating.  There's going to be 30 or 40 Democrats running for the nomination next time, I think I'll put you somewhere on the list.

AJ "Thank you."

BBC You've not said no. 


====


people

Angelina Jolie Doesn't Want Her Kids to Be 'Perfectly Behaved': 'They Have to Find Themselves'

Dave Quinn and Phil Boucher December 28, 2018 12:55 PM

"Children can do two things,” she explained to host Justin Webb, when asked what drove her move from her “wild” past to her more serious, humanitarian work. “They can make you grow up, and you do, and they also add a sense of wild themselves.”

“[My kids] all have a good rebellious streak that is wonderful and curious,” Jolie said. “I don’t want them to be perfectly behaved little people that just say what’s absolutely appropriate because I say so … they have to find themselves.”

...
“I think, like most parents, we try our best to insert good stuff and we can’t control everything that they’re exposed to, so we try to ask that they will talk to us about anything they saw that bothers them or that they’re concerned about,” Jolie said on BBC’s Today.*
...

Angelina Jolie will join @BBCWorldService as executive producer to pilot a global English-language current affairs programme for children in 2019 called 'Our World'.

Read full press release here 👇https://t.co/eGzLgObI0B pic.twitter.com/jvqsyWznKf — BBC News Press Team (@BBCNewsPR) December 28, 2018

The BBC, joined by Angelina Jolie as executive producer, will pilot a global English-language current affairs programme for children in 2019, Our World. It will include ten episodes of a weekly programme.

Angelina Jolie says: “There has never been a time when it was more important to introduce the next generation to objective, impartial news and factual explanation of the events and issues shaping our world. Children today are exposed to a lot of opinion, but not necessarily to information that is fact-based and reliable.
"As a mother, I am very pleased that the BBC World Service is taking this step. It is also important to me that the project is global, and will help young people in different countries to be connected to each other and to have greater awareness and understanding of the news on an international basis.”
One of the main objectives for Our World is to promote global media literacy.
BBC World Service Director Jamie Angus comments: “The internet is a democratizing force. It gives voice to the voiceless. But the downside is that it enables some of the worst conspiracy theories to spread. According to a US survey from last year, over a six-month period, 59 percent of 10-18 year-olds had shared a story that they either subsequently found to be inaccurate or were now uncertain as to its veracity.
"No parent can completely isolate their child from fake news. But what we can do is give kids the tools to distinguish the genuine from the false and encourage them to develop critical thinking - to ask themselves: who produced the video and why? Are they a reputable organization? Are they just telling one side of the story? Is there another view?”
The programme will be aimed at children aged seven to 12. BBC-commissioned UK research shows seven is the age that children become aware of the news and 12.6 (2016 Common Sense Media) is the average age a US child signs up for a social media account. So the time between seven and 12 years of age represents a window to instill in children the value of asking questions and a chance to develop critical thinking.
Our World will provide much needed impartial access to information of the highest editorial standard, helping young people to understand the world around them and encouraging critical thinking. It will bring reportage in a safe and child-friendly way, without speaking down to younger audiences.
Globally, children are a chronically and acutely underserved demographic. A 2017 US survey by Common Sense Media found that 69 percent of 10-18 year-olds agreed that news media has no idea what the lives of tweens and teens are really like. Seventy four percent think that the media should show more people their age, rather than adults talking about them. The same survey revealed that the news left 45 percent of tweens feeling afraid.
This project aims to be truly global in scope, engaging children from Argentina to Zimbabwe. It will start with an English version but the BBC will seek production partners to expand programming into multiple languages.
Our World will be a multimedia project with digital and broadcast elements, including a weekly half-hour TV show. In 2019, the BBC will be launching a 10-week trial of the project. The BBC is in talks with a number of international public-spirited digital and broadcast media organizations interested in co-production and distribution. The pilot TV programmes will be distributed via the World Service’s existing TV partnerships and via other suitable broadcasters internationally.
The BBC is the world leader in producing news for children. The BBC has produced its flagship Newsround show in the UK for 40 years. In autumn 2018 the World Service launched two Africa-focussed TV children's shows: What’s New? in English and Actu Jeunes in French. The new global English language programme, Our World, will build on this experience and expertise.
Our World will be a non-commercial venture. The BBC and Angelina Jolie see this project as an investment in the young.

BBC

Our World -Cambodia: The Power of Memory BBC Documentary 2017

Hello - 6 March 2017


scans

 

Random Fuzzy

Brief observations:

They have now reestablished contact with People and Hello both of which were given exclusive photos taken by Pax.  Hello also had an exclusive interview where among other things, she explained the rather curious designation of Pax as an official set photographer.  People has not had an interview yet but Mary Green has resumed writing about them so they'll probably be getting one soon.


The photo by Pax that they gave to Hello where lens flares blur her face was obviously meant to leave her hands and ring as the central focus.  Out of the possibly hundreds of photos taken by Pax, she chose this one which offers little else to see as the rest of the frame is out of focus.  That makes two photos that she's had a direct hand in choosing and releasing that both draw attention to her hands and ring  -- the other being the first official photo of Mon Guerlain.   She would have had her choice of photos from the Mon Guerlain sessions as well.  Viewed against the message that she has been reiterating that they are and will always be a family, the message she seems to be sending with her choice of photos that draw attention to her ring is that they are and will always be married -- that they are and will always be a couple.


She also apparently has more than one band that she wears on her ring finger.  There's the gold band with a rope design that appears to match Brad's, and there are a few diamond encrusted ones that she sometimes wears alone or with the gold band.  The one she is wearing above appears to be similar to the one in the Mon Guerlain photo and video. 

-- Fussy

Pride&Joy (thanks)  shares:

BBC The Cultural Frontline (Audio) with Yalda Hakim

Audio is drawn from the same interview aired earlier. On the topic of the incident there is this additional exchange coming after her first response:

BBC:  Because you haven't said much actually, the tabloids have been doing all the talking for you.  And you haven't said anything at all actually.
AJ: And I won't.

#AmbHeidt hosted #FirstTheyKilledMyFather author @LoungUng and her family Monday at his residence. #Cambodia. pic.twitter.com/KgqLOeHJgC

— US Embassy Cambodia (@USEmbPhnomPenh) February 28, 2017

Random Fuzzy


Stephanopoulos' aside that Brad was "of course a part of the family" made it a two-part question but it is clear that the main question was if she still believed he was a wonderful father, and her response was "of course."  In saying "of course" emphatically even without elaborating she gave him a strong endorsement as a father.  So it would be reasonable to conclude that one of the reasons why they are and will always be together and a family is because she still believes him to be a wonderful father.

Stephanopoulos noted, as we did, her use of "family" in her initial statement which was a big hint that she was also looking after Brad.

The GMA interview followed the BBC interview.  Unlike with a face to face interview, a satellite interview always involves a split second lag and it somewhat affects the flow of the interview and our perception of her reaction to the question. 

BBC: We know that an incident occurred that led to your separation. We also know you haven't said anything about this.  Would you like to say something now?
AJ: "...Only that...I don't want to say very much about that...except to say it was a very difficult time. And, and we are a family and we will always be a family, and we will get through this time and hopefully be a stronger family for it,

BBC (audio) :  Because you haven't said much actually, the tabloids have been doing all the talking for you.  And you haven't said anything at all.
AJ: And I won't.
BBC: Can I ask how you are coping?
AJ: "I'm, I'm...Many, many people find themselves in this situation and this kind of...my whole, my family… we're all, we’ve all been through a difficult time. It's not ...My focus is my children, our children… and it is...and my focus is finding this, this way through. And as I said we are..we are and forever will be a family and so that is my...that is how I am coping.  I am coping with finding a way through to make sure that this somehow makes us stronger and closer.”

The point of the first part of her answer above is one she frequently makes when asked about how she copes -- whether its taking care of six children or her many commitments or her health -- that her position isn't unique or even exceptional.  That she wasn't the only one in a difficult position, they all had a hard time and many other people have to cope with similarly difficult family situations.

BBC: What do you really want to do when you wake up first thing in the morning?
AJ:  "Get through the day.  It's been a difficult few months.  Right now, I’m going through a moment where there's just everybody’s in my room.  Two dogs, two hamsters and two children at the moment. It’s wonderful. But, usually, I just wake up trying to figure out who’s going to get the dog out, who’s going to start the pancakes and did anybody brush their teeth.” 

It's been a difficult few months but now she can say she's having a wonderful time.  And I made the point in the previous post that part of the reason is because those latter thoughts are directed at the people in the room and indicate Brad is there and alternates with her in making pancakes.   Needless to say, she did not bring the dogs and hamsters to Cambodia and they are not taking over the hotel kitchen to make pancakes.  She is talking about their home life.  While there are again no photos of Brad, the family has been away from L.A. for at least a week and Brad would not want to be apart from them that long.  As with Crested Butte they would have found a way for him to slip in and out quietly.  Angelina herself seems to be traveling quietly as there are no airport photos of her.

GS: You filed for divorce, you said, for the health of your family.  Is your family healthier now?
AJ:  We are..we are ..... focusing on the health of our family, and so..and so we will be.  We will be.  We will be stronger when we come out of this because that's what we're determined to do as a family."

GS: In the past you described Brad often as a wonderful father, of course he's part of the family.  Do you still believe that?
AJ:  Of course.  Of course.  We will always be a family. Always.

She gave what looks and sounds like a sigh of relief.  She had a fleeting hint of a smile before she composed herself and proceeded to answer deliberately.  She searched to find the right word and seemed to start to say "working" but shook her head and chose "focusing."  Unlike "working," "focusing" doesn't necessarily connote any action on their part.  So while she may have declined to say so at  this time, they don't need to do anything more to be a healthier family.  She paused but did not sigh when responding to the question about Brad.


"When (they) come out of this" will be when their legal path is cleared, "this" being the dissolution petition.  Being legally married turned out to provide valuable protection for the children because the divorce petition served as an umbrella under which legal safeguards for the children's recovery could be put in place and enforced by the court.  It's a benefit of being legally married that Angelina never imagined she would need.


Her answers became firmer and more definite.  She went from, "We will get through this time and hopefully be a stronger family" and "make sure that this somehow makes us stronger and closer" to "We will be stronger when we come out of this because that's what we're determined to do as a family."


She was consistently firm and resolute in saying "we are and forever will be a family"  and "We will always be a family. Always."


******

"...get through .... come out... stronger... closer...."

She didn't use any of the key words from past statements -- healing, recovery, reunification.  Or delicate and sensitive.  We know she wouldn't be talking about getting through and coming out of this unless they were in fact already through and out of it.  The children have recovered.  The family has healed and they've been reunited.  They are back to being a family.  A healthier family.


They are all visibly happy and relaxed -- including Brad before Jan. 25.  Her face hasn't been this full in years so she has been eating well.  In her interviews she was often lighthearted and playful. She is clearly in a very happy and jovial mood.


The family is already stronger and closer so she can confidently say they are, always and forever will be a family.  She didn't say they have always been a family.  She is saying now and in the future.


-- Fussy


******

EW

Nick Romano@NickARomano

Posted on February 21, 2017 at 9:35am EST

Angelina Jolie made an appearance on Tuesday’s Good Morning America, where she addressed how her family is doing in the wake of her filing for divorce from Brad Pitt last fall.
“We are focusing on the health of our family, and so we will be, we will be stronger when we come out of this,” Jolie told ABC News’ George Stephanopoulos during the interview, “because that’s what we’re determined to do as a family.”
She added “of course” she still thinks of Pitt as a wonderful father and part of the family. “We will always be a family, always,” she said.
Jolie spoke to GMA from Cambodia, where she has been promoting her latest directorial effort, First They Killed My Father. The film, which will be released on Netflix, is based on author and human rights activist Loung Ung’s book of the same name recounting her suffering under the horrific regime of Khmer Rouge.
“This country means a great deal to me. This country has been through so much,” Jolie said. “Forty years ago this war affected every single individual here, and I wanted to understand [it] myself. I don’t know much of my son’s [Maddox] birth parents, but I believe they would’ve gone through this war. I wanted to understand him and his culture in a deeper way, and I wanted to bring this story to this country in this country’s language, and I wanted to tell the story of Luong Ung, who’s a dear friend of mine.”
...

Random Fuzzy

we are a family and we will always be a family, and we will get through this time and hopefully be a stronger family for it,

"“My whole, my family… we’ve all been through a difficult time. My focus is my children, our children… and my focus is finding this way through. We are and forever will be a family. I am coping with finding a way through to make sure that this somehow makes us stronger and closer.”"

A family that goes through divorce is permanently a broken family.  A week after she filed,  a "family member " told PEOPLE, "Her family is broken and she is in agony."  She is no longer in agony.


Angelina made a point to repeatedly say "we are a family"and I highlighted "a" because the meaning is very different from "we are family" without the "a".  "We are family" without the "a" means they have a close relationship, but "a" family means that they are one, single, united, unbroken unit.

"we are a family and we will always be a family ...We are and forever will be a family."  --  She repeatedly emphasizes that they are, always and forever will be a family.  She is making a strong and definitive statement that she and Brad are and will forever be together.   She is saying that the bond between them will never be broken.  In other words, she is saying they will be partners for life.  


"My whole, my family… we’ve all been through a difficult time. " --  We've noted from the start how her use of "family" was meant to include Brad. 

"Right now, I’m going through a moment when just everybody’s in my room.  Two dogs, two hamsters and two children at the moment. It’s wonderful. But, usually, I just wake up trying to figure out who’s going to get the dog out, who’s going to start the pancakes and did anybody brush their teeth.”  

She had previously said, "If you ask any of the kids about us...  Daddy makes better pancakes than Mommy."  She previously said, "School is at 8:30. We get up at 7:30 and make breakfast."

In an interview with the Guardian two years ago: "Right now Jolie Pitt “family sleep time” – a sort of camp out in the master bedroom – is becoming a thing of the past. “Some of them still want to come hang out in our bed, but some are really starting to like their privacy.” --  So they're now down to just the two youngest.


People's tone and coverage has drastically changed since Saturday when Mary Green resumed writing about them.   They are now careful to say "Since her divorce filing from Pitt."  As we've noted the filing was just a temporary measure , a structure that housed the safeguards for the children's ability to heal properly away from Brad and under the guidance of their therapists.


BBC was also careful to say "an incident occurred that led to your separation."  There was no mention of divorce or even the filing. 


While promoting By The Sea she said (all sources below):

We thought, this is the best honeymoon because we felt, as the film says in the end—whatever you go through, weather the storm and stay together. It was a message to each other of we are going to weather whatever comes and we are going to stick together so that was nice.

And again

“So many times, people divorce very quickly. To me, if this film has a message, it’s that you have to try to weather the storm together no matter what. And that’s a beautiful thing.”

They are revealing things slowly and guiding expectations.  I feel that we may be getting a more in-depth interview with Mary Green or another journalist they've had a relationship with soon.


******


Wasser 12/1:  "it is incumbent upon us to help this family achieve their long-term reunification goals in a smooth and expeditious manner."

Joint Statement 1/9:  The parents are committed to act as a united front to effectuate recovery and reunification."

BBC 1/20:  "We are a family and we will always be a family, and we will get through this time and hopefully be a stronger family for it....We are and forever will be a family. I am coping with finding a way through to make sure that this somehow makes us stronger and closer."


-- Fussy


******

Watch: exclusive interview with Angelina Jolie about her latest film on the Cambodian genocide https://t.co/hJO0LOOuTG

— Yalda Hakim (@BBCYaldaHakim) February 20, 2017

"You want to share a spider?" - Angelina Jolie cooks bugs in Cambodia 🕷https://t.co/5mSi3VNErT pic.twitter.com/OZ12DjpyJD

— BBC News (World) (@BBCWorld) February 20, 2017

Angelina Jolie on her 'difficult' split from Brad Pitt: 'We will always be a family': https://t.co/SZGGfhUaYS

— People Magazine (@people) February 19, 2017

By Alexia Fernandez•@alexiafedz
Angelina Jolie opened up about her shocking split from Brad Pitt for the first time since filing for divorce.
The actress and director spoke to BBC World News‘ Yalda Hakim in Cambodia in an interview that was released on Sunday. When asked about the split, Jolie revealed that it had been a “difficult” time for her family.
“I don’t want to say very much about that, except to say it was a very difficult time and… and we are a family and we will always be a family, and we will get through this time and hopefully be a stronger family for it,” she said.
Jolie, 41, was in Cambodia to promote her new directorial effort, the film First They Killed My Father. The mother-of-six said she was coping by maintaining a focus on her children: Maddox, 15, Pax, 13, Zahara, 11, Shiloh, 10, and twins Knox and Vivienne, 8.
“Many, many people find themselves in this situation,” she said. “My whole, my family… we’ve all being through a difficult time. My focus is my children, our children… and my focus is finding this way through. We are and forever will be a family. I am coping with finding a way through to make sure that this somehow makes us stronger and closer.”
Since her divorce filing from Pitt, 53, Jolie revealed that her children and pets have been trying to find a normal rhythm.
“It’s been a difficult few months. Right now, I’m going through a moment when just everybody’s in my room,” she said, laughing. “Two dogs, two hamsters and two children at the moment. It’s wonderful. But, usually, I just wake up trying to figure out who’s going to get [the] dog out, who’s going to start the pancakes and did anybody brush their teeth.”
When asked where she saw herself in five years, Jolie couldn’t help but realize she’d have a house full of teenagers by then.
“At that stage, I hope just standing,” she said, joking about being outnumbered. “In five years’ time I would like to be traveling around the world visiting my children, hoping that they’re just happy and doing really interesting things, and I imagine in many different parts of the world, and I’ll be supporting them.”
“Everything I do I hope is that I represent something, and I represent the right things to my children, and give them the right sense of what they’re capable of, and the world as it should be seen,” Jolie added. “Not through the prism of Hollywood or through a certain kind of life, but really take them into the world, where they have a really good sense and become rounded people.”


******


Below are relevant quotes from them pre-September

WSJ

The Examined Life of Angelina Jolie Pitt

....

Says Pitt, “When Angie has a day off, the first thing she does is get up and take the kids out.  This is the most important ‘to do’ of the day.  No matter how tired she might be, she plans outings for each and all.  She has an incredible knack for inventing crazy experiences for them, something new, something fresh. I may be the bigger goof of the pair, but she invents the stage.”

....

It also doesn’t sound as though they have to worry much about Mom and Dad as a unit either. “When something happens in your life that’s a dramatic thing, you either pull together or you go into your own,” Jolie Pitt says, referring to By the Sea and the trauma that drives a wedge between Roland and Vanessa. “So many times, people divorce very quickly. To me, if this film has a message, it’s that you have to try to weather the storm together no matter what. And that’s a beautiful thing.”



Sydney Confidential 11/ 2015
I wonder, after so many years together, has marriage changed anything between them?
“I don’t think so,” the star reflects.
“If anything, it challenges you because you really start to think about the rest of your life. You feel very tied. It’s interesting for me having his last name.
“Everything you do becomes as ‘wife of’… which is an interesting transition.”
The biggest step for the couple, she goes on, “was when he adopted the kids. That was something. Because you can always get divorced, but you can’t walk away from parenting.
“That was a big, not a hard, thing, but I really wanted to make sure that nothing would go wrong for the kids.”



 inquirer

Angelina Jolie on directing, and life with Brad Pitt and their kids

By: Ruben V. Nepales
 ....
 So can you talk about that—you just had your wedding and you had to direct Brad.
....
We thought, this is the best honeymoon because we felt, as the film says in the end—whatever you go through, weather the storm and stay together. It was a message to each other of we are going to weather whatever comes and we are going to stick together so that was nice.
 ...

What have you learned over the years about relationships? What do you tell your children about relationships?
Those are heavy questions like I am in a therapy session. But you are right, it’s good and I should be asking myself this. I think I have learned a lot. There is a discussion on compromise. I feel the opposite. I feel like you have to really maintain yourself and you have to help the person you are with to be the best version of himself. You need to really stay… [the way] you are and make sure that you are not asking him to bend in a way that is not natural to him.
That is what I learned. It’s also very important to have a common goal. That’s what keeps people together—your moral fiber is the same and you have something that you are doing together that matters. You have purpose and certainly children are the easiest way to have the sense of purpose together because no matter what, they are first.
I try to talk to my children a lot about anything. If they ever hear their mommy and daddy argue, we try to explain to them what we were talking about and why and most of all, you want your children to be able to ask you questions. Like we say to them, did you have fears and are you worried? If their friends’ parents are divorced, they want to sit down and ask us questions and want to know.

As Angelina Jolie awaits the release of 'Unbroken,' she says directing husband Brad Pitt brought them 'closer'

Her WWII survival drama, about Louis Zamperini, is set for Christmas Day; she teams up with Pitt in 'By the Sea' 

BY  JOE NEUMAIER

....

 Jolie tells the Daily News that directing Pitt while the two made her marital crisis drama, “By the Sea" — opening next year — made her fall in love with him more.

“It brought us closer,” she says.

 “The scenes on ‘By the Sea’ were so tense that we let out (any stress) on camera. There’s really heavy fighting in it, so I think sometimes the crew felt like, ‘Mom and Dad are having a fight!’ — because Brad and I are the producers too,” she said. “Success or failure, it’s all on us.

“But it was all oddly freeing. We both wanted to do something as artists ... and push each other. So we got this opportunity to go out there and play.

“I had missed being that free as an actor, and to do that depth of work, and what a pleasure it was to do it with Brad, because I really saw him as an actor, not just the man I loved,” she says. “In the end, it was an amazing thing, because there’s no actor who wants to help me more, or push me more as an actress, or give me more as a director or writer than my husband, and there’s no man I want to see succeed more than him. We were so there for each other.”
......


telegraph

'Angie and I were aiming for a dozen': Brad Pitt on kids, marriage, and being directed by his Wife

A middle-aged husband and wife, playing a middle-aged husband and wife at a critical moment in their marriage – it does not take long for Pitt to make the leap, as if he has not only been anticipating the discussion but can’t wait for it.

'Certainly the attrition rate of Hollywood couples looms large.’ He swigs from his bottle of water. 'And I’m surprised how much our history – Angie’s and mine – means to me. That we have this story together. That we know each other. That we watch each other getting older, through amazing moments, joys, pains.’

He repeats the phrase with a sense almost of wonderment in his voice. 'That we know each other. It means so much to me. 'I don’t know. I’m just surprised, because you hear people talking about the old ball and chain, and people trying to recapture youth, as if that’s the impulse – but it’s not the impulse, it’s not the impulse at all.’

But isn’t that what you enter into a relationship expecting – or at the very least hoping for? 'It is. But again, there are no books to tell you what year 12 is supposed to be like, and year 14 and year 23 – no guidebooks. What I’m saying is, I’m surprised how much it means to me, how much value I place in it. I’d equate it to having kids.

Everyone talks about the joy of having kids – blah, blah, blah. But I never knew how much I could love something until I looked in the faces of my children.’ Pitt, 51, and Jolie, 40, are parents to six children, three biological – Shiloh, nine, and seven-year-old twins Knox and Vivienne – and three who are adopted: Maddox, 14, Pax, 11, and Zahara, 10.

It is a family unit that he describes as 'a lot of love, a lot of fighting, a lot of refereeing; a lot of teeth-brushing and spilling… Chaos, total chaos. But so much fun.’

It was always his dream to have a big family, he says. At college he had a friend with whom he would sometimes stay who had five brothers and two sisters. 'It was absolute mayhem on the weekends, and so much fun. His mom would be making breakfast for everyone, throwing eggs and pancakes around, and I thought, that’s the way I want to do it.’

He laughs. 'Listen, Angie and I were aiming for a dozen, but we crapped out after six.’ His own upbringing, he says, was 'never that raucous’. Pitt has a younger brother and sister. He grew up in Springfield, Missouri, where his father ran a trucking company – a Baptist upbringing, 'with all the Christian guilt about what you can and cannot, should and shouldn’t do’. (He now describes himself as an atheist.)

His father was 'very, very tough’, but not, he says, in the 'father knows best’ way. 'He could be a softie. But one thing my folks always stressed was being capable, doing things for yourself. He was really big on integrity – and that informed a lot of what [we] try to do now.’

Is Pitt the disciplinarian in the family? 'I am with the boys.’ He smiles. 'Girls do no wrong so I don’t have to be. I feel like my job is to show ’em around, help them find what they want to do with their life, put as many things in front of them, and pull them back when they get out of line, so they know who they are.’

....

Hello

Angelina on Brad as a father:

"It's such a beautiful and sexy quality in a man when he takes his responsibilities as a father very seriously.

"I still get very emotional when I watch Brad play with the children – he is so naturally devoted and joyful around them."

Brad on the meaning of their beautiful day:

"I was surprised afterwards at the effect that getting married has had on us – it was more than just a ceremony, it meant a real depth of commitment. I feel like a married man – I really do."

Angelina on her adopted son Maddox encouraging their relationship:

"He just out of the blue called Brad Dad. It was amazing.

"We were playing with cars on the floor of a hotel room, and we both heard it and didn't say anything and just looked at each other.

"So that was probably the most defining moment, when he decided that we would all be a family."

 Angelina on building a family with Brad:

"He has expanded my life in ways I never imagined. We built a family. He is not just the love of my life, he is my family. I hold that very dear.

"I suppose what I've learned from Brad is to be able to have the kind of family whose happiness and well-being comes before your own."

Angelina on being lovers as well as parents:

"The children certainly tie us together, but a relationship won't hold if it's only about the kids.

"You also must be really interested in each other and have a really, really wonderful, exciting time together. We do. Brad and I love being together. We enjoy it. We need it, and we always find that special time."

Angelina on what she loves about Brad:

"I am very lucky with Brad. He is a real gentleman, but he is also a real man's man.

"He's got the wonderful balance of being an extraordinary, great, loving father, a very, very intelligent man and physically he's a real man."

 Angelina on their friendship:

"After all these years, we have history.

When you have history with somebody, you're friends in such a very real, deep way that there's such a comfort, and an ease, and a deep love that comes from having been through quite a lot together."

 Brad on their love life:

"She's still a bad girl, delightfully so. It's not for public consumption."

Brad on letting their children know they love each other:

"There are no secrets at our house. We tell the kids, 'Mom and Dad are going off to kiss.' They go, 'Eww, gross!' But we demand it."

 Brad on Angelina as a mother:

"One of the greatest, smartest things I ever did was give my kids Angie as their mom. She is such a great mom. Oh, man, I'm so happy to have her."

 Brad on the noisy Jolie-Pitt clan:

"There's a constant chatter in our house, whether it's giggling or screaming or crying or banging. I love it. I love it. I love it.

I hate it when they're gone. I hate it.

Maybe it's nice to be in a hotel room for a day – 'Oh, nice, I can finally read a paper.' But then, by the next day, I miss that cacophony, all that life."



People

Brad and Angelina: Their Evolving Views on Marriage, in Their Own Words

By Tim Nudd

Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie once vowed never to get married until everyone in America could legally do so.
Below, check out the couple’s evolving views on the topic, in their own words, dating back to 2006.

October 2006
“Angie and I will consider tying the knot when everyone else in the country who wants to be married is legally able.”
• Pitt explains to Esquire why he and Jolie are not ready to wed

July 2007

“We’re not against it. It just doesn’t seem necessary. He and I have never discussed it in detail, but I would assume – because we [both] went down that road before – it’s not that contract or that ceremony that makes you feel solid. We’ve gone the back way around, and maybe there is something to that – that it’s the hard work and the exhaustion and the children that really do make you solid.”
• Jolie to Marie Claire

June 2008

“People have made a lot out of it that we’re not, but we both have been married before, and it’s very easy to get married, but it’s not easy to build a family and be parents together. And maybe we’ve done it backwards, but we certainly feel married.”
• Jolie to Vanity Fair

August 2008

“When someone asked me why Angie and I don’t get married, I replied, ‘Maybe we’ll get married when it’s legal for everyone else.’ I stand by that, although I took a lot of flak for saying it – hate mail from religious groups. I believe everyone should have the same rights. They say gay marriage ruins families and hurts kids. Well, I’ve had the privilege of seeing my gay friends being parents and watching their kids grow up in a loving environment.”
• Pitt to Parade

June 2010

“[We’re not] against getting married. It’s just like we already are. Children are clearly a commitment, a bigger commitment [than marriage]. It’s for life.”
• Jolie opens up to Vanity Fair
RELATED: Brad & Angelina’s Top 10 PDA Moments

May 2011

“The kids ask about marriage. It’s meaning more and more to them. So it’s something we’ve got to look at.”
• Pitt tells USA Weekend

August 2011

“[There’s no] secret wedding.”
• Jolie denies in a Vanity Fair interview that she’s pregnant, adopting and tying the knot

September 2011

“The kids are putting on the heat. They really are. They are putting on the heat. How do you I get out of this one? Somebody help me. I don’t know what the future holds.”
• Pitt to Ellen DeGeneres on her talk show

December 2011

“The kids asked me the other day, and I asked them if it was just because they wanted to have a big cake. They see movies that have the people getting married in the movies or somebody’s, you know, the happily ever after. Shrek and Fiona are married. We’ve explained to them that our commitment when we decided to start a family was the greatest commitment you could possibly have. Once you have six children you’re committed.”
• Jolie to Christiane Amanpour in interviews that aired on Good Morning America and Nightline

January 2012

“We’d actually like to [get married] And it seems to mean more and more to our kids. We made this declaration some time ago that we weren’t going to do it till everyone can. But I don’t think we’ll be able to hold out. I’m not going to go any further. [But] it means so much to my kids, and they ask a lot. And it means something to me, too, to make that kind of commitment.”
• Pitt to the Hollywood Reporter about his changing stance on marriage

January 2012

“We’re getting a lot of pressure from the kids. It means something to them and they’re, you know, they have questions when their friends’ parents are married and why is that? … We will someday. We will. … [But the kids say], ‘Get mommy a ring!’ Okay, I will, I will.”
• Pitt in an interview with CBS News
“I think anything said tends to be blown out of proportion.”
• Jolie to PEOPLE on the red carpet at the Screen Actors Guild Awards when asked about the recent flurry of "ring talk," which Pitt says was "his fault"

November 2012
“I am getting more pressure from my kids, and it is something I want to do within their lifetime. The time is nigh. It’s soon. I got a good feeling about it.”
• Pitt to PEOPLE at the Killing Them Softly film premiere in New York

May 2014

“We will get married, and we’re not really in a rush, so we’re just waiting for it to be the right time with the kids, with work, when it feels right. We talk about it occasionally, and the kids talk about it with us. Which is verging on hysterical, how kids envision a wedding. They will in a way be the wedding planners. It’s going to be Disney or paintball – one or the other! We’ve got a lot of different personalities in the house. They’ve got some strong opinions. It will be fun. That’s the important thing. When we do it, it will feel like a great day for our family.”